Littoral
Viewing comments for Chapter 11 "Weaker than Water"Poems about the coastline
14 total reviews
Comment from Sugarray77
A wonderfully complicated piece that shows talent and immense skill in writing poetry. All points are well done and the subject, which an obscure one to most of us, is handled deftly. Love it.
Melissa
reply by the author on 29-Jun-2022
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A wonderfully complicated piece that shows talent and immense skill in writing poetry. All points are well done and the subject, which an obscure one to most of us, is handled deftly. Love it.
Melissa
Comment Written 29-Jun-2022
reply by the author on 29-Jun-2022
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That is really kind of you to go delving back in the past to find the original post. i have made a few changes since gthen but nothing drastic. Glad to know you must be enjoying the calss to bother that much. Many thanks.
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I am really enjoying this class and can truthfully say that I'm being challenged and stretched as my poetry flows to fit the requirements. :)
M
Comment from ciliverde
You're awesome...I just love this. It's quite true that the ancient Celts loved alliteration, and it probably sounded wonderful in their language (as it does in ours). It's true that the legends said the union was happy, the man and wife loved each other and she loved her children...but the sea beckoned her so strongly that she was in agony.
I LOVE the addition of Scots dialect here..."She'd gang to sea awa' could she but swim"
and, of course, "You, king, are you yelping yet yesterday's question:
'What's weaker than water?' Muckle mair than you wit! "
Well done, such an enjoyable read. The only thing I'd add would be (as I did) the fact that the man would be followed by a certain seal every time he gang to sea in his boat. He'd know her by her eyes. In the case of my poem, it was the son and the wife who turned to seal form. That was a leap on my part, I suppose, since he was born human. Oh well.
By the way, I was frustrated by many reviews that had NO IDEA what I was talking about. Someone suggested an "adopted son" (???) I didn't think it was that befuddling.
xo,
C
reply by the author on 08-Mar-2016
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You're awesome...I just love this. It's quite true that the ancient Celts loved alliteration, and it probably sounded wonderful in their language (as it does in ours). It's true that the legends said the union was happy, the man and wife loved each other and she loved her children...but the sea beckoned her so strongly that she was in agony.
I LOVE the addition of Scots dialect here..."She'd gang to sea awa' could she but swim"
and, of course, "You, king, are you yelping yet yesterday's question:
'What's weaker than water?' Muckle mair than you wit! "
Well done, such an enjoyable read. The only thing I'd add would be (as I did) the fact that the man would be followed by a certain seal every time he gang to sea in his boat. He'd know her by her eyes. In the case of my poem, it was the son and the wife who turned to seal form. That was a leap on my part, I suppose, since he was born human. Oh well.
By the way, I was frustrated by many reviews that had NO IDEA what I was talking about. Someone suggested an "adopted son" (???) I didn't think it was that befuddling.
xo,
C
Comment Written 08-Mar-2016
reply by the author on 08-Mar-2016
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You have to hold some people by the hand. By the way it was the Norse and Anglo Saxons who went a bundle for the alliterative verse. The Celtic stuff seems more gentle on the whole. Thank you so much for reviewing this and I actually do like your little ending I might try working that in one day. This is one of the original selkie legends. There are many, one quite tragic where the mother marries a gunner on a ship and kills her selkie son with the first shot that he fires.
Have ve been working on a sort of paste up of our book today. Might have something to show for it tomorrow.
Comment from I am Cat
Wow... For me, this was really difficult to read... Either I didn't get enough sleep (which is entirely possible) or I'm not as Scottish as my maternal grandmother would have hoped. :(
So... what's weaker than water?
Man?
(in the face of a naked selkie?... or anything naked for that matter?)
(that's what I gleaned from it)
am I close? or... just hopeful? lol
you're a really really really advanced writer... of course, you have twenty years on me... (yeah, I'm going to play the age card) :P
listen, you really should, if you really want to publish these, change your "content sharing" button to NO. ok?
Otherwise, every browser on the web is sharing these poems ... google, firefox, yada yada yada... making them as good as published already.
and I don't think you want that... do you?
So... I might be finished with this series... I"m sad now.
It was a great run. Now i'm off to find a publisher. :)
>^^<
reply by the author on 08-May-2015
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Wow... For me, this was really difficult to read... Either I didn't get enough sleep (which is entirely possible) or I'm not as Scottish as my maternal grandmother would have hoped. :(
So... what's weaker than water?
Man?
(in the face of a naked selkie?... or anything naked for that matter?)
(that's what I gleaned from it)
am I close? or... just hopeful? lol
you're a really really really advanced writer... of course, you have twenty years on me... (yeah, I'm going to play the age card) :P
listen, you really should, if you really want to publish these, change your "content sharing" button to NO. ok?
Otherwise, every browser on the web is sharing these poems ... google, firefox, yada yada yada... making them as good as published already.
and I don't think you want that... do you?
So... I might be finished with this series... I"m sad now.
It was a great run. Now i'm off to find a publisher. :)
>^^<
Comment Written 07-May-2015
reply by the author on 08-May-2015
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The form can be difficult at first but once you find the rhythms it shouldn't be. To answer your question - what I was trying to say is that it is the call of the sea (the water) that is stronger than anything. Selkie leaves her lover and returns to the sea just as soon as she is able (Once her skin is retrieved). In other words this gives the lie to Chaucer's Prioress who wore a brooch with the legend "Amor vincit omnia" (Love conquers all) In reality it is "Mare vincit omnia" (The sea conquers all). Thanks for the tip about the content sharing button. I'll have to go through them all and change that.
You' are not finished with the series yet. There are plenty more to come.
And thanks for last night's chat. It was such silly, lovely fun.
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It was/is my pleasure... believe me.
Comment from Treischel
I was not familiar with this alliterative verse, but i really love it. I've always liked alliteration. I detected no meter. Are the 12 line, 8, 8, 12, 8 stanzas a requirement. It looks like a minimum of 3 alliterations per line. Let me know any other aspects as Ibsaw no rhyme either. Very intriguing. Love the Gaelic phrase. The poem of the Silkie was also well told and intriguing given the interplay of fisherman, woman, and son. The push and pull of emotions too is like the ebb and flow of the tide.
reply by the author on 03-May-2015
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I was not familiar with this alliterative verse, but i really love it. I've always liked alliteration. I detected no meter. Are the 12 line, 8, 8, 12, 8 stanzas a requirement. It looks like a minimum of 3 alliterations per line. Let me know any other aspects as Ibsaw no rhyme either. Very intriguing. Love the Gaelic phrase. The poem of the Silkie was also well told and intriguing given the interplay of fisherman, woman, and son. The push and pull of emotions too is like the ebb and flow of the tide.
Comment Written 03-May-2015
reply by the author on 03-May-2015
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Thanks a lot for this interesting review and questions, which I will endeavour to answer as concisely as possible. No meter, it was a later development in English poetry, just 4 stressed syllables per line, 2 in heach half line, the bare minimum is two alliterations per line, one from each half, three is to be aimed at and if you can get all four - great! Alliteration may appear on the unstressed syllables but doesn't count. Interestingly the alliterative letter may come at the end of an unstressed syllable, as if it were the beginning of the next stressed syllable. Here is an example from "Beowulf" in the original Anglo Saxon and you can't get much more authentic than that! The stressed syllables are contained in parentheses and the very first one illustrates the point I have just made; in each line, the comma divides the two halves. The final m in the first line and the second g of gongan are surplus to alliterative requirements but they helb the overall feel of the piece.
"Thar co(m off) (moor), under (misth)leothum
(Gren)del, (gon)gan, (godd)es ire bar"
Translated they read:
There came off the moor, under the misty slopes
Grendel, going, bearing the wrath of the gods.
No rhyme either that, didn't appear as a regular feature until Chaucer, in the 14th century. Chaucer by the way was the poet who did more than anything to rid the language of the alliterative style of poetry. When he uses it, which he does only sparinlgly it is usually in ridicule.
The word is Selkie not Silkie as you have written in your review. And my final line is not Gaelic but an approximation of the Scots dialect, which is a slightly different thing.
Finally the breakdown of the lines is not a requirement. I seem to remember meeting Beowulf in a continuous mass of unbroken text, making it a daunting prospect indeed. The fashion these days seems to be to break stuff down to make for easier reading. Sonnets too were a single block of fourteen lines, when I went to school in the fifties, though the sense of four distinct parts was of course always there.
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Very interesting. Thank you.
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You're welcome. I hope it helped.
Comment from Bill Schott
This a great example of a modern classic. Along with the author's notes it keeps the reader actively reading and enjoying a literary devices, ken the Anglo-Saxon era. Great reading.
reply by the author on 02-May-2015
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This a great example of a modern classic. Along with the author's notes it keeps the reader actively reading and enjoying a literary devices, ken the Anglo-Saxon era. Great reading.
Comment Written 02-May-2015
reply by the author on 02-May-2015
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Thsanks Bill for yet another sensitive and thorough review.
Comment from Walu Feral
G'day mate. I bet the ol' king wasn't expecting a response like that when he asked the question. Once again you have produced a work of great beauty and very informative author notes to match. I love this stuff, cheers Fez
reply by the author on 02-May-2015
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G'day mate. I bet the ol' king wasn't expecting a response like that when he asked the question. Once again you have produced a work of great beauty and very informative author notes to match. I love this stuff, cheers Fez
Comment Written 02-May-2015
reply by the author on 02-May-2015
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Another sixpack. You are indeed a mate! I am so glad you are enjoying this stuff fo mine. It is so far removed from the amazing culture in to which you have managed to become inserted. Many thanks indeed for this.
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Always welcome mate.
Comment from w.j.debi
I have not heard the myth of the selkie before so I found this fascinating. I love ancient myths. They tell us so much of life. The love and the longing get all mixed together in the selkie tale, don't they? The poor son having to decide how to show his loyalty and his love for his parents.
This is well written take on the myth. You certainly have piqued my interest in the selkie.
reply by the author on 01-May-2015
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I have not heard the myth of the selkie before so I found this fascinating. I love ancient myths. They tell us so much of life. The love and the longing get all mixed together in the selkie tale, don't they? The poor son having to decide how to show his loyalty and his love for his parents.
This is well written take on the myth. You certainly have piqued my interest in the selkie.
Comment Written 30-Apr-2015
reply by the author on 01-May-2015
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i am so glad this resonated well with you. Many thanks for reading and reviewing.
Comment from Sis Cat
An excellent poem that feels mythic and ancient in its form. Thank you very much for your informative notes which helped explain and set the stage for your poem.
I enjoyed your subject because I love myths. I also enjoyed that you told a story in a poem and you used an ancient alliterative verse form. Your poem shows a lot of study and craft right up there with J.R.R. Tolkien himself. This was a great read that refreshed my imagination and informed my mind. Thank you for sharing.
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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An excellent poem that feels mythic and ancient in its form. Thank you very much for your informative notes which helped explain and set the stage for your poem.
I enjoyed your subject because I love myths. I also enjoyed that you told a story in a poem and you used an ancient alliterative verse form. Your poem shows a lot of study and craft right up there with J.R.R. Tolkien himself. This was a great read that refreshed my imagination and informed my mind. Thank you for sharing.
Comment Written 30-Apr-2015
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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Thank you so much for reading and reviewing this work. I am so pleased you found it interesting. Today I have arrived on the literary scene. I have already been compared with Shakespeare and now you line me up alongside JRT. Je suis arrivé!
Comment from robina1978
Thanks for your foot note which helped me to better understand your poem. Nice artwork that complements your poem perfectly. Nice question you ask: what is weaker than water. Then you write a bout this female.
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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Thanks for your foot note which helped me to better understand your poem. Nice artwork that complements your poem perfectly. Nice question you ask: what is weaker than water. Then you write a bout this female.
Comment Written 30-Apr-2015
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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Thanks for your review. The was no sexist intent. The idea was to show the strength of water - the sea - the power it has to call her back from love, family and everything we have been led to believe to have great strength.
Comment from tfawcus
I'm glad you spared us the full blown Scottish dialect! Burns has always been a complete mystery to me! I was always fascinated by the Selkie story when I was a child and it still has a hold on my imagination. Your alliterative verse flows beautifully when read aloud, surging forward with relentless pace. You've a good mix of the permissible stress schemes, which adds interest. Not an easy form to sustain for any length of time. You've done a great job.
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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I'm glad you spared us the full blown Scottish dialect! Burns has always been a complete mystery to me! I was always fascinated by the Selkie story when I was a child and it still has a hold on my imagination. Your alliterative verse flows beautifully when read aloud, surging forward with relentless pace. You've a good mix of the permissible stress schemes, which adds interest. Not an easy form to sustain for any length of time. You've done a great job.
Comment Written 30-Apr-2015
reply by the author on 30-Apr-2015
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Thank for this, judging by the reviews I have received there are not many on this site the know or understand much about this ancien form. Ithink all poetry (except perhaps the concrete stuff) needs to be read aloud. I read everything aloud virtually everything that I review. This is something one can do better if, like me, you live alone. Of course this form was originated before most people (including the performers) could read so it was speciffically designed to be read aloud.