Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
<< Thread Modifed October 31 at 3:08AM >>
Does anyone remember when honesty used to be the best policy? I'm not sure it is anymore.
Hello again. I am not new to Fanstory, like many other users I have talked to, I have been a user of the site for many years, on and off depending on life circumstances and my time. Moving on...
Nobody likes criticism. I don't even like criticism (but I have learned to deal with and appreciate it.) Why? Because it conflicts with an angry monster named pride that comes to the defense. Let's be honest, if we were all the most astounding writers out there with no improvement, we would all be published. I think there are a number of writers here who certainly do deserve to be published and haven't been because of time, money, and luck. There are also plenty of people here who THINK they should be published, and I would disagree. I don't even think of my own work as good enough to publish. There is so much that I still learn from reading other people's work and even in the last year, I have improved, on and off this site. Now, I would honestly say there are a good number of people here who genuinely want to improve their poetry. There are also a fair amount who really just use this site for community which I think is equally wonderful. That is what this site was for. But, it is not meant to boost each others egos, it is to improve the quality of our craft and make some friends along the way if we can.
The stars are worth...Nothing. It is clout. A way to brag amongst 50-100 people (maybe). It used to be worth something, until they were turned into participation awards.
But now, because people have continued to only give 5/6 for reviews, it means absolutely nothing to me anymore. Your reviews mean something, your words and time mean something, but the stars do not.
Poetry and prose is subjective. Yes, there are areas of technicality, grammar, etc...but it is almost entirely subjective. Rating and reviews are subjective as well for the same reason.
What does everyone want? To get cheap brags or do you want honest meaningful advice that ACTUALLY improves your craft and not just your punctuation and grammar.
Then you need to start giving out fours and reviews appropriately and to be able to receive them with grace. Before you reply to a critical review, may I suggest that you don't reply for 24 hours if you are angry. It is never a good idea to send an angry email at work, it isn't a good idea here. Have a discussion, don't just argue.
Also, don't just put in your pleasantries to meet your 150 character limit and then bounce with your member dollars. That is robbery. Those member dollars are an incentive a payment for HONEST work.
When I read a poem, before I review it, I read it four or five times. I read for enjoyment first, sometimes one or two times, then I read it for the purpose of sharing feedback amongst craftsman. I think about all sorts of things. What would make this potentially better? Was there anything that didn't make sense, was there a different word or a way to rearrange the sentence...etc...And that doesn't mean it is a bad poem. The goal is that hopefully you end up with a poem you like more and grow!
Anyone who has received any review from me that has had any feedback can see that I actually think about it. I make sure that I am not just stealing those member dollars to boost my work at the expense of yours. Because I actually do care about a community of writers who wish to improve and share.
Author notes are a great place to share whether or not you want constructive feedback. If I read that someone is just sharing something personal, I read it as a memoir and offer no critique and just friendly conversation. But if your author notes are blank or leave me with no indication that this is a personal post, I will give you my time?. Honest, genuine time to help you improve. This doesn't mean I'm better than you. I've never once thought like that. I have had a number of you offer helpful suggestions. Believe it or not, I actually remember some of you from when I was 16 years old and I took your advice from those actually willing to give it. And I am returning that to you.
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
Have we met? I gotta say I agree.
nor84
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RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
So do I... BUT there is an assumption that most other members want to improve. They don't. Some think they're already great. Some want to get the end-of-year award, and there are some who just want to get enough funny money to gamble in the contests.
The site used to be different. You could actually learn how to write better. Maybe your action scenes were too wordy, and somebody would actually tell you that. Maybe you didn't write speech tags correctly. They'd tell you that, too. I know.
Now it's mostly a 'social site' and people reward everybody with 5 or 6 stars. This is not the Fanstory I joined in 2006!
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
It could change though if people wanted it to. There?s always the belief that one or two people can?t cause change. It?s a cascading effect. If enough people don?t back and down and they just start doing it the way it was supposed to, you will find that the resistance you first get will get less and less.
No one likes confrontation and I?m not even saying to get into arguments with people angry at you. That is THEIR problem and not yours. Ignore those replies if they are being disrespectful and go about your day.
But eventually, maybe it takes a few months, maybe it takes another year, but eventually as new people join, hopefully they will adopt the culture of accepting constructive feedback.
nor84
Level 4 Pro
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RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
if someone attacks you, you have several options. I think the most effective one is to report the attack by giving Tom the details. Attacking a reviewer is against site rules. The other options are to ignore the attack or to mute the attacker; however, we only have 6 possible mutes.
On the other hand, Tom has removed people from the site if there are enough reports of abuse.
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
Message edited:
Another year. I hate to say, but I doubt it. I've been trying now, seemingly alone, for years now to reverse things. I've shouted, posted in forums, messaged Tom, wrote countless commentary and poetry about being honest in ratings and reviews. I rate and review honestly, I give everything from two to six star ratings.
And what do get from doing all that? I've been muted so many times, there are few posts I can review now. Most of the top members boycott me. I don't bother entering contests. Very few would vote for me, no matter what I write. I rarely place anything on the featured page anymore, because that's just a waste of pumps. I know I will rarely get more than a dozen reviews again.
I've seen members talk crap about me in replies to reviews, while they stroke egos, and lie about how wonderful and perfect their friend's chapter/ 300 word non-fictin blurb, or 5-7-5 was. Real talk. It's all fake. They will write two lines, 150 characters of vague praise then trade a six star or five star review. That writer will swear my review was the only negative or critical review, because they have a dozen six star reviews of gushy praise.
BUT Then comes the monthly awards, and what happens. Now that chapter with a dozen six stars and twenty-five glowing five-star reviews, only gets two votes.... again. Why? Because the votes are anonymous, and they aren't getting paid.
But, it's not just the members. It's also the site. FanStory is a business, and profit comes first. You can easily win the Reviewing Contest now, without ever giving less than a five-star rating all year, and never reviewing outside a small circle of friends, who now trade thumbs too. At the end of the day that all there is now. Social trading of praise, to boost feelings.
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
No. Lance, you're not alone and that does a disservice to folk who do apply the site guidelines.
There's not many and you do get a lot of mutes, personal attacks and abuse.
It's been this way for quite a while.
Socialising has replaced crating.
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
That's true. I'm not alone. You do great work.
I don't think a few of us matter if the site will not make a statement or take a stand. What I said about the Reviewing award is true. It has become a thumb trade among friends (mostly) and if you c an win without ever giving less than a five, it's fake.
I've seen people state, "I saved my sixes for you."
I've seen members give six stars to a blank page. A blank page!!! then say, "Because I know you'll post something great. Sorry about the loss of you dog. Call me later."
Most importantly. I think the top rated posts for the month, was a terrible idea. It ruined ratings and reviews. It is a sham and only incentivized phony reviews and ratings.
RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
One of the reasons I left this site for a good while was that, when I first came here, the stories of the month were inspirational. You could see how they got there. Latterly, I found myself reading 400 words about nothing in particular and wondering why that was crowned story of the month.
I have also been frustrated at some of the narrowness, here. I think there is a degree of 'reviewing according to the site'. What's popular in this site is not necessarily what's great in the outside world.
There are some excellent reviewers on here,most of them are on this thread, but as Lance said, the site is a business. It's set up to reward the 'dash off a few lines' reviewer and the writers of very short forms and that is, sadly, what has taken over.
But, it's a good exercise site, and I am back here to give myself some motivation to write again. I haven't written a thing for at least a year.
Sallyo
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RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
It's a good place to motivate oneself to get a chapter a day (or a week) done. I've been here since 2004, with the occasional break. I'd spend more time if I had it!
nor84
Level 4 Pro
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RE: Reviews are meaningless if you aren?t being honest
I actually got a thumb vote the other night. I've been here since two thousand six and remember well when people did use the review guidelines. I still use them. They can mute me if they want to, I don't care. It just means I won't have to read their trash and can move on to someone I might actually help.
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